Tuesday, November 18, 2008

Obama and Compulsory service?

Obama has proposed that there should be a type of "civil service" imposed upon the youth of america. I personally think that some aspects of this are great; except for the compulsory requirements that it might have to demand. Bellow is a copy of what certain members of his future cabinet aims to propose. You can read it here.

"We propose universal civilian service for every young American. Under this plan, All Americans between the ages of eighteen and twenty-five will be asked to serve their country by going through three months of basic training, civil defense preparation and community service. ...

Here's how it would work. Young people will know that between the ages of eighteen and twenty-five, the nation will enlist them for three months of civilian service. They'll be asked to report for three months of basic civil defense training in their state or community, where they will learn what to do in the event of biochemical, nuclear or conventional attack; how to assist others in an evacuation; how to respond when a levee breaks or we're hit by a natural disaster. These young people will be available to address their communities' most pressing needs."

- First I would like to know what all of you think about this type of establishment, but before concluding, let me explain to you how this is a standard socialist conception. Most socialist feel that this is something that is beneficial to the society at large. Now, if being subject to a large and powefrul government is good, then I guess they are right. Also, how can they pass this reform with the following "wall" in there way (and I am not talking about the GOP minority). 

Section 1. "Neither slavery nor involuntary servitude, except as a punishment for crime where of the party shall have been duly convicted, shall exist within the United States, or any place subject to their jurisdiction"

The former is from the thirteenth amendment, which I like to call the freedom amendment. This amendment seems to prevent any type of compulsory service or obligation that may be imposed upon its people.



And here's to change!


  1. Two things. First, this was written by Rahm Emanuel and co-author Bruce Reed. Not Barak Obama. Go back and re-read your source material.

    Second. This is not all that surprising since Emanual is Israeli. In Israel "national military service is mandatory for Jewish and Druze men and Jewish women over the age of 18. Men serve three years in the IDF (Israeli Defense Force), while women serve two." - Wikipedia.

    I find it surprising that you would take this position as your church effectively forces young men and women to devote 18-24 months as missionaries. I know you may say this is up to the individual, but is it really? Disapproval of the society where one was raised would prevent many young people from saying, "You know what? This isn't for me." The result is many who grudgingly serve.

  2. Two things. First, I made aware that it was not directly Obama that holds that view (I wrote, "a copy of what certain members of his future cabinet aims to propose," and since Rahm Emanuel is a member of his cabinet I am right on the spot).

    Second, I agree with the point you have made that such a proposal seems to be in line with Rahm Emanuel's views.

    However, that does not shun the point that this is a standard socialist move - I would like to emphasis I am not anti-socialist, but am just wondering how such a bill or idea would pass with certain constitutional "rights" in the way.

    Also, I, even though I wish to avoid it, will address you anti-mormon claim.
    1) The LDS church does not force its members to serve.
    - This is an important point; you must understand that there will not be any formal behavior modification or punishment officially enacted by the church.
    -However, if you wish to appeal to what some social group might do, then I concede to the fact that social groups may compel people to do things they wish not to do. Nevertheless, that is an error of the individual and not the functioning of the doctrine, and authority of the church.
    2) You might want to avoid the religious attacks, they are quite unavailing to your position (especially in unrelated posts).

  3. You also wrote, "Obama has proposed that there should be a type of "civil service" imposed upon the youth of america." We all have our own agendas, but this is McCain / Palin level manipulation of facts.

    As we have just proven with Constitutional rights, if there is something in the constitution that doesn't fit into a particular groups agenda, we can just change it. If the religious right wing conservatives can do this, why can't everyone?

    I have very mixed feelings on this subject. I very strongly believe in community service. Do I think that this country would be better off if it were compulsory? Absolutely. Do I think the youth of this country would end up better citizens? To coin Sarah Palin, you betcha! The youth today are perhaps that laziest, most self entitled generation yet. It's sad really. The high school I attended in New York required each student to take a class that required some type of volunteer work. That was only 11 years ago.

    I do not however feel that this is the best way to encourage volunteer service.

    Touché on going off on Mormons again. It's just so easy, I sometimes can't help myself. My apologies.

  4. I agree with you, and I think that it is important for us to be able to "teach" our children to be engaged in life and work. However, compulsion is bad, but maybe necessary - I really don't know. I do understand your frustration with the whole "theocracy" things that are happening in our country. I will try to get a post about this soon.